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Both amplifiers are very good quality-wise.

What they mean by "50 Zapco watts" is the fact that their amplifiers are underrated. Being they produce much more power than they are rated for, if you stuck with the typical wattage at 1% distortion, many amplifiers like these will put out nearly twice the RMS that they are rated for. This really became popular when competitions became commonplace and people competed in given power classes. The high-end companies highly underrated their amplifiers in order to assure better performance, thus more wins, in a given power class. Good for the customer and good for the brand name because you're winning.

In this case I'd choose the McIntosh solely because of the extra power and headroom.

Also, the Zapco C2Ks (not References) are most comparable to the McIntosh amps, at least on the quality of componentry. I prefer the C2Ks a little better actually, but they're quite pricy. Symbilink is just icing on the cake. I'd take the McIntosh over the Reference lineup. This would be if we were talking an apples to apples comparison power-wise.

subster87 wrote: yes 50 watts is 50 watts, but the quality sound wise comming from those 50 watts is going to be different. The zapco would produce cleaner sound previously stated.

Sorry but I have to diasgree. Its imposiable for the human ear to tell the diffrence between two diffrent amps, as long as both are being used within their own limits (and at the same power output).

a watt is a watt really.. now what does happen, is underrating of amplifiers so that "50 watts" on the box is really 70 watts on a scope. That's why some of the better amplifiers seem to be more powerful.. They just aren't rated as accurately, just like the cheapo Pyramids are overrated beyond what they really put out.

That being said, keep in mind it takes twice the power to increase 3dB in audible volume. That means it takes 6 to 10 times the power to double the volume, so the difference between a 50 watt and a 75 watt channel is nearly indiscernible.

All tha aside, if you want to sell the McIntosh, send me a note with what you're asking. I have a good use for that amplifier to power a set of components for my front stage.

Thanks for clarifying it up--I didn't know that it took twice as much power to get a 3db increase. If that is true though, that really makes the speaker RMS wattage very unimportant doesn't it, since in that theory, they'll all be similar in loudness, but different in how they sound (based on what they're made out of). Does that mean really, going from a 50watt amplifier, in the case of the Zapco, isn't really that much of a increase then using the McIntosh, which is 100watt? I was always under the impression that if you double the wattage, you'll "nearly" double the volume with diminishing returns, all things being equal. Am I in the right ballpark?

That being said, if I decide to sell the Zapco or McIntosh amplifier, I'll give everyone on this forum first dibs, since everyone here has been quite helpful. Your advise is really appreciated, hopefully this system will make me smile. :happy055:

3db requires a doubling of power, but doesn't double the volume. An extra 3db is audibly noticeable, but I think doubling the volume to your ear requires something like 10db. More than 8x the power.
The speaker's power handling, or RMS, is important for knowing how much heat (Wattage is a measure of heat) the voice coil can dissipate before melting down.

thats why you put dry ice in your box and give it 8x the power! hahahhaaa

I prefer to dip mine in liquid nitrogen :)

solacedagony wrote:3db requires a doubling of power, but doesn't double the volume. An extra 3db is audibly noticeable, but I think doubling the volume to your ear requires something like 10db. More than 8x the power.
The speaker's power handling, or RMS, is important for knowing how much heat (Wattage is a measure of heat) the voice coil can dissipate before melting down.

We have a winner... Couldn't have explained it better myself.

Thanks for the explanation. Just for reference, when it does heat up and starts to melt down, is that when clipping starts to occur? What type of symptoms can I expect from the speaker? It's still optimal to overpower a speaker then underpower, correct?

I can't help it....Have you not considered Genesis?