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The combination of qualities of a sound that distinguishes it from other sounds of the same pitch and volume.


ok i had to look it up to be able to explain it. my limited vocabulary precluded me from defining the word in the correct context.

Not bad and very accurate, but I have a simpler definition. It is that quality that makes an instrument sound like that instrument. A good example might be a bass drum. A properly built sub enclosure will reproduce that sound accurately, that is the essence of Timbre. I'm sure you have heard a sub in a too small enclosure, that note no longer sounds like what was originally produced by that drum.

And Smoker, I agree with your really long p a r a g r a g h. Some of the blame should fall on the industry itself. In the 80's and the 90's, loud bass was all that was stressed. And many people feel that is all stereo shops do is build annoying and loud stereos. The industry really needs to target a different demographic. I really think you hit it on the nose. I think a lot of people would like something better but don't know where to go. I also agree with your summation of Best Buy and Circuit City. They have no clue, just warm bodies that have no idea what they are selling.

Its getting close to my bed time

"While the sould stage in my truck is mostly correct, I have no depth. Horizonally across the stage, eveything is in the right place, but the drums (for example) do not sound like they are behind the singer. No depth is a function of the interior size and I have not come up with a corrective measure (i'm not getting a new car)."

You should try kick panels, it'll really help with stage depth.

Keep acoustics in mind, theoretically if an environment is smaller than a wavelength, the wave can't fully propagate. Keep theoretical in mind here. In a car, 200hz would be around that point, anything lower than 200 couldn't theoretically propagate in the car environment. Around 6,000hz is where Head related transfer function occurs, which is when our heads create an acoustic shadow. The result is that we are no longer dependant upon pathlengths for imaging, but rather intensity difference (volume).

This can be used for our benefit, with midrange or midbass drivers in kick panels for optimal pathlength differences. This allows us to use dedicated midbass drivers in the doors if we want to, and transitioning with the mid somewhere around 200-300hz. This also allows us to use tweeters in A pillars to add stage height, width, and depth, without negatively affecting our perception of imaging due to our hearing characteristics. The older MB Quart Q series and QSDs were really good for this, the 6.5" midbasses could go up to around 6khz and sound good doing it with some tuning. The JL XR and ZR midbass drivers are capable of this, too.

you bring a tear to my eye...........that was beautiful


i put together a crossover one time for a set of comps i had bought at a local shop (this is like 12 yrs ago)
anyway i had used a 6k hz crossover point and they told me i was nuts but i had mounted the mid in a pretty strange area....it wasnt really the kick panel but it wasnt really floor either and mounted the tweet up high on the windshield post area and it sounded great.....

yes, timbre (pronounced TAM'-br) is the quality that makes a sound unique even when sharing the same duration, frequency, and pitch of another sound.

It's why every speaker sounds a bit different to the listener.

if I can get my hands on some Esotar tweeters, or if I end up going to ribbons, I'll end up building my own crossovers for the front stage.
At the moment they use the Dyn 6dB/octave slopes, which are really shallow. Great for musicality. Not so freat for focusing the speakers or for power handling.

Yeah, the tweeter doesn't do too bad with the System 360, 2nd order keeps it pretty composed. The 2 way sets it has a lower x-over freq and it tends to be a little strained and doesn't blend as well with the midbass driver

It's that 1st order highpass on the dome midrange that's a killer. That mid begs for mercy when the volume is cranked. Only real negative thing I can say about the set.

I always thought that Timbre was what the lumberjacks say.... :)

Jonathan wrote: You should try kick panels, it'll really help with stage depth.

While you are absolutely right,then where would I put my center channel amp??

Actually, kick panels were considered and ruled out because of the emergency brake pedal. I was not willing to move or modify it. And now it would be difficult to do because of the location of my center channel amp, which is flush mounted in the passenger side kick panel.

In the near future I will be replacing the 60/40 bench seats with buckets from a Mustang. It will allow me to add a Music Keg and maybe move one amp in between the seats. Then I might be able to consider Kick Panels

O.K. Sound Q is dead but NOT IN THIS FORUM

I'd ditch the center channel and just do the kicks, personally. Get 2 channels to image well and you won't need a center channel, anyway. Look into sets with dome mids, like the DLS Iridium 6.3, or some home audio raw drivers (which would be much cheaper). If you get one that'll cover around 300hz-6khz or so you'll be golden. Domes like the DLS are sealed back and shallow, they won't take up a lot of space or interfere with the e-brake.

aahhh......center channel speakers..........ranger you take me back man with all your kenwood equipment and stuff it reminds me of days gone by when dei did not rule the earth........