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solacedagony wrote:That's an oversight as well. Every piece of equipment has limitations. Maybe that McIntosh deck can output at 1/10th the distortion that the Pioneer or JVC decks can? Obviously, there can be a subconscious bias due to money or brand or product, but that doesn't mean that one product isn't better than another (or sounds different).

For $1000 and McIntosh's reputation, I'd be pretty upset if the equipment they put out ISN'T audibly better. Otherwise, what's the point of owning anything other than flea market stuff if there aren't audible differences?


It'd be really neat if someone had the know-how and equipment to do distortion and power testing on decks to see what you're really ending up with.

How could you prove its audibly better? you cant its subjective.

How can you prove its not?

There is a very strong minded nay sayer on CAF...

If all radios sound alike then why doesnt the SQ crowd run the cheap $75-$150 radio's? I mean a $1000+ McIntosh unarguably comes with absolutely 0 features so its not for features. Many of the SQ decks wont play MP3's and are just as barren as the McIntosh's.

Most noteable is the "High End Head Unit Showdown"

http://forum.elitecaraudio.com/showthre ... did=121657

Question them if you like. The one is the current USA IASCA Champ I believe...

Bwcad1 wrote:How could you prove its audibly better? you cant its subjective.

You can prove that that it has better distortion/power/crosstalk/whatever ratings and prove that it's audibly better for "SQ". I see what you're getting at. Maybe you LIKE the sound of a higher distortion driver/deck/amp/what have you. But we're talking strictly SQ here and things of that nature (lower dist./etc)are "better" sounding.

In any case, I think pretty much all points of view were covered.

i did that test i can hear the difference to .75 hz easily i think its from 22 years of being a musician out of 25.

colemanyoungerinalaska wrote:i did that test i can hear the difference to .75 hz easily i think its from 22 years of being a musician out of 25.

.75hz difference from 20 to 20.75 or from 18000 to 18000.75

Also, testtones are a whole lot easier to differentiate than sounds in music are.

when it comes to differentiating sounds in music i have no problem different timbres dont confuse me

I had the MX5000 combo...and it was bar none, the best sounding headunit I have ever owned. Sonically, you can tell the difference. That 1000.00 price tag isn't just for Name, it is for the absolute best components money can buy, built into one small little chassis with a happy little D/A converter tagging along on an umbilical. Couple this with the MCD5000 CD Changer, MC4000M 6 channel front stage amp, Custom McIntosh 3-way front stage and then the two MC425's powering my McIntosh 12's....this was, sonically, probably the best sounding car I had ever owned...but, it didn't image nearly as well as my Focal/Mark VIII or the Taurus with HLCD's. But it was by far the best sounding

I'm glad this has sparked so many opinions.

For the time being, I am going to limit my head unit to something in the $500 range. I'm still up in the air between the Pioneer and the Eclipse.
Are there any other options that are similar to these?
Is the pioneer DEH-800PRS just a newer version of the 880PRS?

After hearing ryan's review of the pioneer, I'm would have to pick the eclipse. I'm running the 8455, and it doesn't have all the neat toys of the pioneer, but is still a great sounding deck.

And the RCA output stage is phenomenal. Most decks start to clip at around 75 to 80% volume. I tested mine with an O-Scope, and the sub stage started to clip at 90% (output of 8.3 volts) and the front and rear outputs didn't clip till around 97% (again with 8.3 volts output).

All it takes to even it out, is turning the sub output down a few dbs on your time alignment page.

Yeah there are better sounding decks out there. The dennon, Mac, F1 series stuff, but for the price its going to be hard to find something better than the eclipse.

Denon made some units for Rockford. When on clearance they were going for like $200...