just a grasshopper snatching at pebbles

[smoker]

as for value one thing i dont hear anyone recomending is pioneers rev speaker line....damn fine sounding speakers and they make a shallow mount 12" that sounds good also their spl subs kick ass....other than that jl audio xr series comps and mb quarts are killer but higher priced and who doesnt love boston

[Ryan from Ohio]

AS&S191:

To answer why were specific on subs. There has been some new technology that has come about in recent years. This technology is only on a handfull of subs and the prices of these subs are mostly decent. These subs are superior over almost any run of the mill type subs.

Its hard to reccomend a set of front speakers. So much is ridding on them if we say "Brand X for sure" you buy them and are not happy then what do you think of us?

Its not a matter of cheap subs, but these are value based subs from small Audiophile companies who are passionate about bringing you and excellent product you can afford.

Lastly its not about power. Dont make the assumption because its 160 WRMS system it will be louder than a 50 WRMS system. This is false.

The important thing is matching it all up. 160 WRMS comps=160-125 WRMS amp... and so forth.

Your friend will definetley want some kind of a hard dome tweeter... Silk wont do for him.

[omardeth]

first i wanna say you guys have been great . i am learning alot here and i thank you .

KikiTheCat:
if i go with a ported box i will lose my hatchback area , and that something i don't want to do . so i was thinking of making boxes to fit in the corners , the tape measure pics :) . so i will be needing shallow 10's for that . as i only have 9 in now on one side , after the box is made , it will be mdf , i will have maybe only 6 in in depth .but i have 17 in in height . so i should be able to get the volume i will need for the subs . i am thinking of 10's because i am not a basshead , if i could do what i want with 8's i would even go that way . and i don't think i will be able to get 12's to fit into the space i want to use .

Basstronics:
i totally understand what you mean by your comment

Its hard to reccomend a set of front speakers. So much is ridding on them if we say "Brand X for sure" you buy them and are not happy then what do you think of us?

and that my friend you have no worries about . i am sure that the suggestion you all have given me will work for me . i am far from an audiofile , i am more bubba than anything else i am doing as much research as i can . so i am taking all that is told to me and learning more and more each day .

as far as amps i am trying to narrow it down . i have done some reading and i think i have it down to a couple . does anybody have any suggestions ? i have looked at the orion 8004 and a couple memphis models . i am kinda liking the idea of the memphis belle line . it will do the corners and the sub in one amp BUT it is rather long and not sure it will fit on the side of the hatch where i want to mount it . also the jbl and jl's . what i want is clear crisp power . i am thinking 75 to 100 rms . does this sound about right ?
hahaha listen to me i almost sound like i know what the heck i am talking about hahahah

[GlassWolf]

I'd still go with a single 12" sub.
make the box shaped to the floor of the car.
fire the sub straight up.
port the box up as well.
use a wafle style grille over the sub, and all you lose is some depth to the floor of your trunk, while maintaining the ability to throw anything on top of the sub and box and still use the trunk normally.
the amps can be mounted on the side or top of the box, or flush mounted to protect them as well.
it's not all that difficult to do if you're decent with the tools and have a basic idea of making templates to fit MDF to the shape of your hatch area. you'll get better results from one good 12" than from two shallow smaller subs in my opinion.

something to consider.

[GlassWolf]

by the way for the single 12" you'd want about 2cu ft for the enclosure, plus driver and port displacement. If you go sealed, you'd need about 1.2 to 1.5cu ft. either way you should get good results going that route.

[Ryan from Ohio]

If your heart is set on 10's and power/$ is an issue I would reccomend the Resonant Engineering RE series 10's.

That JBL Amp I reccomended will power two efficently.

You should have enough room for a ported box if it was right up against the rear seats. The RE's dont need much area for ported. Fire the port straight up...

If you put the subs in the corners you WILL run into cancellation issues and lack of output due to the direction and so forth. If you put both subs on one side it wont be so bad but you will loose out on SPL.

[omardeth]

i never thought about the canceling out of the 10's in the back . that is something to think about . i really don't want to do a big box on the back of the seat . i don't want to lose my hatch space . i still have to do things with the car , i'm an ole man . the idea of doing the boxes in the corners was to save the hatch area . do you think i can get a 12 in a space that is roughly 11 deep by 17 high by 13 ? i might be able to get it to 15 or 16 " long IF i angle the back alittle .

[Dragon_fire]

Diamonds HEX series components are pretty intense. You can find em on ebay for around 275. and can haggle a dealer down to 350. Plus you can throw power at em like they were subs. Awesome comps. choice of silk or metal tweets.

[Jonathan]

A 11"x17"x13" box would be just under 1 cu ft. internal volume assuming that you used 3/4" MDF to build the box.

When choosing a sub, remember that there is a three-way relationship for what you choose. Low-frequency capability, box size, and efficiency are those three, and to increase any of the three, you have to give up something from the other two, with box size being the most sensitive. Since you want a small box, your SPL capability with a given amplifier power and your low bass performance will suffer to an extent. Best thing to do is to use the largest box you can live comfortably with, based on the performance you want. It's a necessary evil, unfortunately.

There are some 12" subs that will work with that airspace sealed, but ported isn't an option with that airspace. Just off my head, one 12" sub that works very well with that airspace is the Image Dynamics IDQ 12". It isn't an SPL monster though, I wouldn't expect huge volume levels with it, it would simply offer authoritative depth and would fill in the low end nicely. If I were in your shoes (don't want to lose the hatchback at all) I'd use a single 12 since cancellation is such an issue with opposing sides and you simply can't squeek two 12s in a 1 cu ft box. For the sub, I'd choose an Adire Audio Brahma or Resonant Engineering XXX for subwoofer duties. Both are capable of working well in that amount of airspace and will provide solid SQ and SPL for your needs. In most cases one is enough. The Brahma is the more efficient sub, in the end the XXX gets a little louder, though.

As far as the components go, the Focal 165 V2s that you were looking at are a power set, punchy midbass and a stronger tweeter. They work well with rock. If I constantly listened to hard rock, I'd choose them over the others, if you wanted a smoother tonality for classical, jazz, etc. I'd go with the DLS and so on.

[omardeth]

thanks alot jonathan , you have given me alot to think about . let me ask you this . if i do go with a dual sub setup , weither it be 10's or 12's , a sub box is a sub box correct ? as long as it has the volume needed for the sub being used correct .

what i am getting at is if i get one of those cheapo box setups that you can get at lets say an auto parts store . you know the ones for like 100$ with 2 subs and an amp . and just yank the subs out and replace them with good ones . as long as the box is made well and and sealed up and have the right volume size , it should be ok yes ?

also is there anybody in the sacramento area that is following this thread that wouldn't mind helping out with this project ?

i was planing on buying the parts and haveing a local installer put it in .